Kamal Datta (00:00.046) that one of biggest differences is that A, we built ours natively into the platform. So it's not like an add-on solution, right? And it's been built specifically for the needs of the endurance space. So it's not like a HubSpot or a Salesforce that's powerful, but generic. We use HubSpot as our own internal CRM as well. And it's great. I love it, but it's, it's generic. So it takes a lot of time, effort and money to configure that specifically for our needs and then it would take a lot of time, money and effort for an endurance organization to configure it specifically for endurance needs. And so we've done the heavy lifting of saying, hey, here's a CRM that's already configured based on the needs of endurance organizations and nonprofits. Hey, listeners. When you think about an endurance sports event, like a racing event, It's a puzzle of interconnected functions that needs to come together to deliver an outstanding experience. Traditionally, technology solutions solve for a piece of the puzzle. For example, solving for race registration or maybe for marketing or maybe for communicating to the participants. That's where Haku saw an opportunity to build an all-in technology platform for the running industry with CRM as its core and the rest is history. In my discussion with Jacqueline Levi, Chief Strategy Officer and co-founder of Haku, we dive into the founding story, how Haku is able to deliver efficiency for event organizers through cutting edge technology, the different trends Jackie saw over the years and where the industry is heading in the age of AI. I'm your host, Kamal all Datta and this is What Runs A Run. Thanks for listening. Kamal Datta (02:02.2) Welcome, Jackie, to the pod. I'm really excited to have you here today. Hi, it's nice to meet you, Kamal. thanks for having me. I'm really excited to be here and to chat with you today. Great. I know we've been trying to have this conversation for quite some time. I'm glad that it worked out really well that, you know, we finally could chat today. Yes, I'm excited too. To start with, for folks who doesn't know Haku, you are the co-founder and Chief Strategy Officer for HAKU. You want to give a quick introduction of what HAKU is and who does it support? Yes. So like you said, my name is Jacqueline Levi. I am the Chief Strategy Officer here at HAKU and one of our co-founders. Our company was founded by myself, our CEO and our COO, our CEO and our COO brothers, our CEO is my husband. So we kind of started as a little family business, but now we're quite a bit bigger than that. Yeah, and we are a technology platform for endurance event organizers and nonprofits. And what we do is we help them, our technology helps them run their business basically from end to end. So everything from event management, registration, CRM, marketing, where they're all in one platform for registration, event management, fundraising, engagement, marketing, kind of everything in between. yeah. That's what we do. That's great. I definitely want to hear the founding story of Haku Jacqueline. Maybe you can start there before you deep dive into learn a little bit more about Haku and then all in platform and how it actually is helping the events as well as the nonprofit. So if you can take us back to the founding story, because I'm very curious. You mentioned that you started as a little family business and now it is really big. So if you can take us back there. Yeah, absolutely. So back in 2010, I started at a company called Care Cloud, which is a healthcare IT company here in Miami. They do practice management and electronic medical record software. So an enterprise SaaS company in the healthcare space. That's where I met Carlos. He worked there as well. He was one of the co-founders there. They're VP of software engineering. He's a software engineer. Kamal Datta (04:28.672) Jose also worked there as well. So that's really where I met them and got to know them. And at one point, know, Carlos really wanted to get out of healthcare, start his own technology company, and was really just trying to figure out what opportunities existed and where he felt like his and Jose's experience and skill sets could build something that could bring a lot of value to that, that industry or that market. It just so happened that at the same time he was trading for his first Ironman. Went to go register for the event and could not do it on a mobile device, had to do it on a desktop. This was 2011, I believe. And so he was like, you know, I have an iPhone. I can bank on my phone at this point. I'm just really surprised that I'm not able to register for this event on my phone. And it really got him kind of piqued his interest of maybe there is a gap in technology here. And maybe that's a place where we can solve it and being a patron of it. You know, it's an industry that I'm really passionate about. would be really exciting and really interesting to be able to work in this space and bring technology to this space. Cause that was our expertise, technology. Like I said, he's a software engineer, my background is user experience design. So we had all worked in technology for a long time. Jose's expertise is in operations and customer service. So. felt like the three of us had a good skill set to really bring to the table, to build something in an industry that we were already patrons of. So that really led us, like Carlos and Jose, to do a lot more digging and more research. And what we learned was that there really was no business platform in the space. It was really registration systems. And so what they had was a registration platform, but it didn't... do a whole lot else. Maybe there were some bells and whistles, but really the core of it was all about registration. And to our viewpoint, you we had worked in other industries. The fact that the industry really weren't using CRMs, they weren't really being adopted, there wasn't really a lot of knowledge about what a CRM was or what it did or the benefits it provided really led us to believe that there was an opportunity to build something a little bit different in the space and bring a lot of value through technology. Kamal Datta (06:50.338) So that's what we set out to build is really an all-in-one business platform with a CRM at the core. And so before we even had a registration form, before we even had anything that could transact, we really got to work on building that CRM native as a native part of the platform. Cause we felt like that was going to be a key differentiator and a key value add into this space. And so that's really where Haku started. We were officially founded in July of 2013 and here we are today. Wow. That's a fascinating story that you found a problem that did not been solved that point of time. You alluded to the point that most of the solutions that time were registration platforms. And then I think the key differentiator when you started Haku was that you started as CRM at the core and then in build on top. If you say fast forward 12 years, in 2025 today, how do you see that the market has evolved versus where Haku is in terms of, because I think you mentioned Haku as an all in platform, right? And solving all the aspects of event management to start with. Yeah. Is the question like where we are today or where you see us in 12 years from now or where we are today versus- we today in 2025. Yeah. Yeah, I think the industry's come a long way. You know, back in, I think it was 2016, maybe it was, is really when we started to hear the industry really talk about CRM a lot. There was a whole session on it at Reading USA and that's really where actually that's kind of the year that Haku really started to take off because the industry was really kind of absorbing this knowledge of CRM and we had that at our core from day one. And so we were well positioned to kind of. come in and show people what you could do with a CRM solution. And then not just any CRM solution, but what you could do when it's built in as a core part with registration, with memberships, with e-commerce, how it can really be a game changer. Now fast forward to today through COVID, all of that sort of stuff. think a CRM is really even more critical than ever because... Kamal Datta (09:13.954) When you look at where technology is going, when you want to talk about things like AI, it really, the backbone of it all is still data, right? And what can come out of it is only as good as the data you put into it. And so when you don't have that single source of truth, when you don't have that central hub through a CRM or a CDP or anything like that, then it's going to be hard to capitalize on really powerful AI tools, automation tools, workflow tools, like all those things have to be built around a really solid core solution. And so I think that puts Haku in a really well positioned space to accelerate the technology that we offer through AI and automation. Yeah, I'll be curious to talk about the AI part. think you recently launched out a natural AI part. I'm curious to learn a little bit more on that. When you talk about the CRM aspect, And you said you have a strong background in UX. I'm thinking it out loud. Like if you think about a persona, right, that usually goes to the, for example, the event management, say, as a platform. So if I'm a runner or I'm the race director, an event organizer, how does Haku brings value to the CRM as its core versus something in the market? Maybe it's a pure registration software with some built-in tools around it. Yeah. I think the, the, one of the biggest differences is that A, we built ours natively into the platform. So it's not like an add-on solution, right? And it's been built specifically for the needs of the endurance space. So it's not like a HubSpot or a Salesforce that's powerful, but generic. We use HubSpot as our own internal CRM as well. And it's great. I love it, but it's It's generic, so it takes a lot of time, effort, and money to configure that specifically for our needs. And then it would take a lot of time, money, and effort for an endurance organization to configure it specifically for endurance needs. And so we've done the heavy lifting of saying, hey, here's a CRM that's already configured based on the needs of endurance organizations and nonprofits. So that's a big factor in it. Kamal Datta (11:39.01) You know, the other part is that when your CRM is core and native to your platform and built in with registration, with your marketing tools, with your e-commerce tools, it really unleashes so much power and efficiency around the day-to-day work that you do. Let's take email marketing, for example. So I think this is a great use case. We're actually working with some of our partners on this right now. and executing on really highly segmented marketing campaigns because segmented marketing is higher performing, you get better ROI, you see better revenue results. So with a platform like Haku's, because that data is built right in and it's natively part of the platform where our customers do their email marketing, where they do their e-commerce and registrations, they can do things like build. a highly segmented audience and layer that on top of email automations. So as an event organizer, I could say, hey, I want to build an email automation where when someone registers five days after registration, I want to send them this welcome email and say, here's what you need to know about our event. But I don't want to send a generic welcome email. I want to tailor it based on who I'm engaging with. So with our system, you can segment that out. and you can send different automations based on the profile or the persona of the person. So you could send a welcome email, one welcome email to people who have never done the race before and say, hey, welcome, it's your first time, here's what you need to know about the race, here's our first timers packet, here's what you're gonna wanna look out for. And then you could send a different automation to people who are returning from last year or the year before. and have completely different messaging for them. And it's all automated. You go in, you build your audiences, you save them, you set up your automation, you save it. And then every time that trigger is hit and someone meets the criteria, the email is automatically sent. So it's a way to do really tailored and segmented engagement without a lot of effort or cost. That's cool. You're talking about Kamal Datta (13:55.694) You built in some capabilities with HACO platform, which probably would have taken a couple of tools for the event organizers to put it together, have the communication out, because there are dedicated tools to actually do that segmentation, have a communication out, personalize it, right? That is probably a built-in, what do call it, the value add from HACO's platform that people are seeing. In my pod, I had opportunity to talk a little bit different aspects where TechMoney is supporting and I do see that some of them are built in within the HAKU like volunteer management part or you know the part where you know what is happening with the race day. A lot of the race registration companies or the timing chip providers actually handle that part of like race day experience and I see that you built in part of the HAKU. Do you want to elude some of the key value add on those couple of areas, how people are getting value out of it? Yeah, you know, it really all goes back to that CRM and that is the core of it. But to really make that CRM really robust, it's building strong features around it. So we often say we're not a registration platform. Registration is one of the really powerful features we have. We are a technology platform. We're an ecosystem. So that includes, you know, of course registration and we support lots of different types and flavors of registration from drawings and lotteries to rush registration to team relay teams, all sorts of stuff. But so we've got registration, we've got event management, we've got onsite tools. So that's dynamic BIM assignment, t-shirt fulfillment, product fulfillment. So if someone buys an add-on product in the registration path and you do onsite pickup, you can manage fulfillment through our onsite tools. We've got an e-commerce module. So you can sell products through a single inventory. Kamal Datta (16:05.974) Not only can you sell them in the reg path, but you can sell them in accounts. You can also build a standalone storefront like a Shopify and sell them through a completely branded and customizable storefront. We have a memberships module. We have a marketing module, which includes a fully native email marketing suite, includes a reward system. So our organizers that work with us can build rewards programs. And because it's layered on top of that CRM, it's easy to build out highly dynamic rewards programs that are fully automated. So you set the criteria that people need to meet to earn the rewards, and then they're able to unlock those rewards immediately based on the criteria you set. So you may say, hey, we're gonna offer this rewards program that includes three merchandise items, two discounts, and one event invite. To anyone who... completes at least five races with us and spends at least $5,000 in the year. And once they meet that criteria, those rewards automatically become available to them and they can go in and claim them. There's nothing the event organizer has to do to find those people. The system handles it for you. So I mean, that's just a small selection of the tools that we offer. There's so many more, but we'd probably be here for a couple hours if I through everything. this is a perfect example of a tools dedicated to that, like the reward program that are dedicated to SaaS tools, actual supply that you built in part of this. And I'm curious a little bit over the nonprofit side of things. Looks like this is a core offerings of Haku. And I'm just curious in the journey from 2013 onwards, what time you felt that, we need to build supporting the nonprofits part of it. Because you are a runner yourself, and you know that lot of runners It's a very integral part of the whole event experience nowadays, having a nonprofit kind of engagement there. When was it part of the road, and it clear that, this is core part of Haku's offering? Yeah, I mean, we've been working with nonprofits for seven, eight years, it's been a long time. So it's not new to our business. We've never... Kamal Datta (18:20.034) really told that story very strongly on our website, which is that's what's new. I'm not sure if you saw that we launched a new website last week. Yeah, I saw that announcement. Yeah. Yeah. So it's not, it's not new to our business. We've been working with nonprofits for a long time. We just felt like, you know, we wanted to tell that story about how we serve nonprofits more. And so that was really the big driver behind the website change and the update to the website and wanting to tell our endurance story more clearly as well. So yeah, I mean, we really got started in the nonprofit space. I would say about 2015, 2016, a nonprofit who did a big charity by grad reached out to us and they had had their own platform. And I said, hey, we're looking to get rid of the platform we have. From what we've seen, we really like your event management and registration tools. And we know you have a CRM. It's really very interesting to us, but you have to have peer-to-peer fundraising. At that time, we didn't have it. But the event was local. We really liked the mission. And we saw the opportunity that could exist with the fundraising aspect and knew that a lot of endurance programs also had fundraising. The endurance space is very intertwined with the nonprofit space. So it seemed like a natural value addition to the platform. So we really worked with them to build out the peer-to-peer fundraising aspect of what Haku could offer. So allowing people signing up for endurance events, bike rides, walks, runs, et cetera, to be able to also fundraise at the same time, commit to a minimum, all that sort of stuff that you see in your traditional peer-to-peer fundraising. And it really just kind of snowballed from there that nonprofit ended up growing into something much bigger than just a charity bike ride. They're now a full-fledged foundation, and they do auctions, and they do galas, and they do DIY fundraising, and they do general campaigns. They have a giving circle. They do recurring giving. So we really grew alongside them and really built out the rest of the platform to support nonprofits. So now we support auctions, we support galas, we support ticketed events of any kind, tournaments. So nonprofits can really use Haku to fundraise in any way, shape or form. So all the fundraising they do, they're able to do that through Haku. And it's really a natural extension of the endurance space. It's built on a lot of the same Kamal Datta (20:46.68) core functionality. So the event, you know, all the different event types use a lot of the same functionality. The core modules like CRM, marketing, rewards, all of that stuff is the same across the board. So it really was a natural extension to what we were already doing in the Endured space. That makes a little sense. And I know I have been, there's many series I'm doing on fundraising aspects. And I happen to check with some of the peer-to-peer P2P fundraising kind of folks. And then they bring up lot of challenges there and there. And I do see how you're already solving. mean, the process of publishing some of these conversations on there. But this is amazing to see. A curious question. So Jackie, you, Jose, and Carlos are endurance athletes yourself. I wonder where Haku stands today, how you being an athlete and endurance athlete. shaped the way Haku is today. I'm sure it is. It impacted tremendously, right? Yeah. I I certainly would not call myself a very good endurance athlete, but I run. I've done a handful of marathons, many halves. My brother-in-law's done many halves, too many to count. And my husband's done two Ironmans and 30-something marathons. And I don't even know how many halves. Yeah, we're, like I said, a big part of why we started Haku is because we were patrons in the space. And I'm a big fundraiser. Every race I do, I fundraise. So I fundraised several times with St. Jude. It's a big cause that I'm very passionate about. I'm actually fundraising right now for the Chicago Marathon on behalf of Team... Cool. Yes, on behalf of Team for Kids, which is the New York Roadrunners charity. So big shout out to both New York Roadrunners and Team for Kids. Yeah, I think the biggest thing for us when building Haku is the organizations want to deliver a certain experience, right? And that experience starts well before you get to the expo or to the start line. It starts with the first time they interact with your brand online, whether it's your website, whether it's your registration form, whatever, a social post, whatever it is. That's where Kamal Datta (23:07.118) their experience with you starts. And every touch point needs to deliver the best experience they could have. It doesn't have to be perfect, you no experience ever will be, but it really needs to be engaging. It needs to be a smooth experience. needs to be, deliver some sort of delight in some way, right? Like you want it to also be memorable, not just. Okay, I did that, that was easy. If there's a way to delight them along the way so that you stick in their mind, that's always a great value add for brands. And so that's always something we've kept in mind as we've built the tools we built. It's what it kind of experience to runners want to have and... How can we, as a B2B SaaS company, build something that enables our customers to deliver that experience, right? It's not our experience to deliver. It's our job as a B2B SaaS company to empower our customers with the ability to deliver that experience. So we've always taken the position that Haku is behind the scenes. We're providing the tools to the customers. we're empowering our customers to deliver the experience they need to deliver it. Because it's not the same across the board either. So I think you'll find that reflected in, know, whenever you register for an event that uses Haku, you most often do not see Haku. very much behind the scenes. The brand is front and center. It's very customizable. They can really build out that experience for what is right for their brand, what's right for their event experience, what's right for their audience, not what Haku says it should be. Yeah. Now let's talk about this. I know Haku is behind the scenes. If you to mention some of the, think Haku supports some of the biggest races of the events in entrance space in the world. If you want to share some of them so that for our audience to understand the scale at what Haku operates. Kamal Datta (25:18.124) Yeah, so we work with organizations of all size, we do have a of customers that are kind of a larger enterprise organizations. Those include, you know, the Bank of America Chicago Marathon, Marine Corps Marathon, Houston Marathon, New York Roadrunners, Big Sur. We work with events internationally as well. So the Vienna City Marathon. Yeah, so we work with organizations like Route 66 and Beyond Monumental. So we do work with organizations of all size. And I find that our partners, especially kind of the larger enterprise ones, one of the big reasons they value Haku is because the high level of customizability that the platform offers. See, I'm running the New York City Marathon a couple of weeks, right? And I'm going through the 9 plus 1 program in New York last year. So I'm using N.Y.R. New Year's Planner's platforms. I had no idea it was Haku. Now I know. Yeah. Everything's fully white labeled for a lot of our customers. And again, that just goes back to our ethos of that we want to be, we want the events brand, the organization's brand to be the star, right? We don't, we don't want to be the star. We don't need to be the relationship that the runner has is with the event and with the event brand and the events and the organizations have worked so hard to build that. brand recognition, build that brand affinity between them and their customer, and we don't want to stand in the middle of that. That's great to know. Yeah, I think that's obvious that you can see at least I as an outsider that experience in HAKU that New York Road Learners is the forefront, not what's supporting New York Road Learners. So that looks like in the alignment with what you mentioned that where HAKU stands. I want to deep dive into going forward, or maybe before you go going forward, Jackie, some of the trends that you have seen, and I want to touch on a little bit on the partnership aspect, probably you are, Hakui is actually known for in the industry as well. What are the trends you have seen, especially since 2013 onwards, that, know, Hakui is pioneering ahead? Kamal Datta (27:38.558) that you would like to highlight, hey, these are the trends we've seen and this is the trends we have to keep an eye on in the end-to-end sports industry. Yeah, mean, AI, obviously, from a technology perspective, is the big one and not going away anytime soon. So from a technology perspective, that is top of mind for us. I think it's top of mind for everybody. I will say that From a trend perspective, it's important to kind of look at what is a long game, what's gonna be here for the long term, and then what's kind of a fleeting trend so that we're not investing a lot of time and resources as an industry into things that are short-lived, right? It's kind of like when you shop for a wardrobe, you wanna invest in timeless pieces and maybe save on the trendy pieces, but. The same here, it's always an investment of time and resources into something new. And I would say the biggest trend I'm seeing in terms of strategy, right? Like not talking about specific technology is how to build loyalty and repeat participation. So I think it's pretty clear that running is on an upward trend, but it's still to be seen. Is this a trend like we saw back in 2011, 2012, 2013, where running had a big boom and then really sort of plateaued and kind of even dropped a little? Or is this kind of up and up going to be sustainable long term? That's where loyalty and engagement really comes in. Like, how do we turn these people who are coming to running for the first time, who are generating this sort of boom that we're seeing? How do we make them, how do we... How do we make sure they're here to stay? How do we make sure that they're here for the long run, right? Are they gonna be one-in-a-gen runners? Are they gonna run for a year because it's trendy and it's interesting and then kind of drop off in a year or two because it's no longer trendy and it's not the thing everyone's doing? How do we capitalize on this opportunity to really turn these people into long-term loyal participants, not just for specific events, but running as a whole? Kamal Datta (30:02.766) Right, right. So based on that, are you in a boom? There's a lot of discussions, debates are happening that we are in a running boom. And to your point that is it a sustainable running? That's the question strategically you're asking. But to the data point as of moment, does the data show that we are in a boom? I don't think we'll know until we're out of it. of it. To really say one way or the other. We were, yeah. hindsight's always 20-20, so I think we'll know when we're on the other side, whether we can call it a boom or not. I will say there's a couple different key differences now than back in the 2010s when the last running boom happened. The really widespread adoption of short form video-based media like TikTok. has put running front and center in a way that it never could have been before. The running space did not have the visibility like professional sport, like other professional sports like football or like professional basketball. It didn't have the budgets, right? You're not gonna get that air time when an NFL game is bringing in millions and millions of dollars every game, right? So that kind of free, highly accessible... impactful short form video format media is allowing running to become front and center in a way that it just didn't have the ability to before. And so I think that's a big reason why we are seeing this uptick of interest in the running opportunity. And lots of really exciting things are happening in the running space. know, Kelvin Kipton nearly beating Sub2it Chicago. You know, lots of exciting. things happening in track and field. And given that that can be highly accessible on those platforms like TikTok, I think is putting running on the map like it just never has been before. So my hope is that this is different than the 2010s because of those factors and will help turn, will help capitalize on the people who are new to the sport to stay and be part of it longterm. that's a definitely a great way of looking at it. Now, coming back to your point on Kamal Datta (32:25.006) role of AI for the industry. And you just recently launched Nachos AI. I want to see what is your vision for Haku for AI specifically. And then, you know, if you want to highlight a couple of the things that you should keep an eye on as an industry, that AI, how AI can enable these experiences better and better. Yeah, for us, I mean, we're a business platform. So we offer technology to businesses. We're B2B SaaS. And so For us, AI really has the power to do some incredible things for our customers, really around a couple core areas. And it's all about building efficiency in an organization's workflow. Like, how many manual day-to-day tasks are people doing that can be automated because of AI, right? And we don't see that as like, hey, this is taking someone's work away. It's, hey, this frees you up to do more strategic growth work, right? When you're not having to manually, you know, solve this task or run this report or do this pivot table, right? You're able to then say, let's establish this new initiative. I think it's very different in the running space too than in or in the endurance space and even the nonprofit space than maybe, you know, like CPG, where you have Fortune 500s who have thousands of employees and massive budgets, right? Like most nonprofits, even some of the largest ones, are pretty lean teams. Building that efficiency through AI is really gonna allow them to focus a lot on growth initiatives rather than day-to-day maintenance of their organization. And so that's always what we've strived for at Haku in building our technology. That's what we've been able to do with a lot of our partners and AI will only accelerate our ability to do that for our partners. That's great. Plus, endurance industry in itself is a, I don't know if it's a seasonal business is a right wordings, but it's spring and fall heavy business, especially in North America. So if you're optimizing, you know, the time period, is the rush period that happens, the craziness that that two period. Kamal Datta (34:46.19) I think it will add a lot of value to the event organizers for sure, if we can do that through AI. Now, another area I wanted to touch on is the partnership. I think you are big on, because I don't know how many people I've talked to on the podcast who said, you have to talk to Jackie on your pod. And, you know, I talked with Jay and you're a great partner. think you are sponsoring the event coming up in February in Kansas City, running USAEvent. Can you tell a little bit about how, what is Haku's strategy in terms of partnership that people can learn from it? Yeah. So we absolutely see ourselves as a partner to our customers, not just a vendor. So it's when you work with Haku, it's not going to be here's your login and go and figure it out, right? We're very much with you along the journey to help you find success. And it's about being strategic partners. So it's about you know, helping them find every inch of value in the Haku platform. And then also providing our insights, because we work with so many event organizations, providing our insights of what works based on their specific goals. So, you know, we are very tied in and understanding our customer goals on a regular basis. You know, what are those goals? Where are you trying to accomplish? Here's how you can best use the platform to do that. Here's strategies we've seen work before. Here's the data that backs that up. and really helping them implement. So I know we talked about segmented marketing earlier. Over the past couple of months, we've been working with a handful of our customers to transition them from like really more of a mass marketing strategy to a segmented marketing strategy and helping them not just navigate the platform to do that, but helping them define their strategy. So what are the right segments to reach out to based on our community? You know, how do we talk to each segment? What's the content plan? What's our content calendar? And really helping them build out a really robust segmented marketing plan. And then of course, how they use the platform to execute on it. But it's more than just the tactical aspect. It's really that strategic aspect that we bring to the table that we find our partners really, really value. Great. And then I think you support running USA, right? The big event that you put together. Kamal Datta (37:04.052) And I think they also support in return their customers or their members, which are also the event organizers in the industry that put together those events. So in another way, you're supporting this whole community of event organizers, you know, in the country and outside the country as well. What's next for Haku? What are the challenges that you are solving next or in the horizon that you can share, Jackie? Yeah, it's really just building. We have a very mature platform. I mean, it's very robust. We've been building it for 12 years. It has a lot of powerful capabilities. And it's really taking that to the next level, right? And so taking the features that we have and iterating on them, adding new modalities to ensure that our partners have the latest and greatest technology always. We are technology people. We are product builders. Like at the end of the day, that's what we're here for. We love building technology and that's what we wanna do every single day to serve our partners is just constantly be building technology. There's always new stuff to build. There's always stuff to make better. There's always new tools that we can bring to the platform to better support our partners. So it's continuing to do what we do. AI is a big part of that strategy, of course. Like you said, we recently launched our Nacho product, which is our AI companion. We also are launching our new AI data analytics tool within the platform, which will allow customers to ask Nacho, their AI companion, about their data. In addition to providing some predictive analytics in the platform through AI and some analytics tools that we provide. So those are things we're really excited about. And we're just excited to continue building really great technology. That's awesome. Is supporting runners or the angler's athletes by themselves is in Hakos, I don't know if that would be wrong word, in vision? At this point in time, it's not. Again, our focus is really on supporting the event organizations, the businesses behind the events. Kamal Datta (39:29.868) They're really the experts in connecting with the runners. And we don't want to dilute their brand. We don't want to compete with them in that space. We really see it that as like, if we're also trying to connect with the runner, if we're trying to sell something to the runner, if we're trying to put our brand out there, we then crowd the marketplace and become a sort of competition to them, right? So we don't want to be that. We want to support them. We want to support their growth, their engagement and bring runners directly to them through their own experience, not through a Haku experience. No, that makes sense. So you're to be in the B2B space, not into the B2C space, supporting the end users of the event itself. Cool. Are there any interesting facts with the data that you are seeing, Jackie, that you want to share, the industry trends? Yeah, I think overall, we're the... At least for our customer base, the age of runner is starting to pull down a little bit. It's starting to come down a little bit, which is really exciting. I know overall the industry is pretty on the older side on the. male side on the older male side. So it's exciting to see that a lot of our partners have been able to capitalize on shifting that demographic a little bit and capturing a new demographic. I think that will do wonderful things for the running space to just bring more people into it and have a wider community to grow the sport altogether, which means more potential customers for everybody. Yeah, I think that's the most interesting trend we've been seeing. I think there's a big uptick in marathon participation as well. least for our partners, granted, we do work with a lot of marquee marathons, so that could be why our data shows that as well. So I know Running USA just put out their global running survey and was able to skim through that and excited to dig into it a little bit more. Kamal Datta (41:35.566) kind of share with our partners what we're seeing and how that plays into the Global Runner Survey. Yeah, I think I remember after I talked to Jay, I did fill it out, the survey. It was like, OK, if you're runner, better fill it out. But yeah, I'll be curious, too. I don't know if it is published formally, but I'll be curious when it's published and to dig in the data it's been shown. So the age group is in the left or the right? Is it getting more younger generation getting into running? I'm just curious. Yeah, we're seeing our partners able to capitalize on pulling that average age down a little bit. Not a whole lot, but it's coming down a little bit, which is great because we kind of need that so our customer base doesn't age out quickly. So yeah, that's been an exciting thing to see and see some younger runners kind of coming into the space more and more. That's exciting too. See for sure. So Jackie, thank you so much for your time. Really appreciate. I'm glad that finally we're able to chat and learn about Haku and thank you for sharing about Haku, Haku's founding journey and where you are and the vision forward for sure. Thank you so much. Thanks Kamal. Thanks so much for having me.